Interview conducted and provided by the Biopresence Press Office. Part 1. Part 2.

Q. Wait as second. You released genetically-modified plants into the environment? Isn’t that highly illegal?

Georg Tremmel. As mentioned before, the company who originally made the carnation had to get the permission to grow, cultivate and sell the flowers. And of course they got it for the markets they want to sell the flowers, and therefore it is legal in these countries to grow the flowers.
So by releasing the flowers we do nothing that is illegal. Because the permission exists, the plants are declared harmless, despite being GMOs.
The goal of the project is to create “Flower Commons”, that means shared, common places, marked by the presence of “Common Flowers”. On a more poetic level, one could say, that we are trying to return the flower ‘back to nature’, to give the flowers a change to discover and create their own nature.

SF. Like probably all cut-flowers, the plants are grown – or better: produced – in large greenhouses. They are harvested before the develop seeds, so the have to chance of sexual reproduction. What we are trying to do, is to give the flowers this ability back. And only because they transgene plants, we should not discriminate against them.

Q. Hmm. I am still not convinced that this is legal?

GT. Well. We believe so, OK Center does not believe so. Or maybe they believe, but being a public institution they have to insure themselves.
Another aspect of the work, which is maybe a bit more dark-gray is the fact, that we are basically violating the copyright of Suntory by growing the plants.

Q. What exactly do you mean by that. Please elaborate a bit more on this?

GT. Well, Suntory created the blue carnation with genes for blue pedal colour and longer shelf-life. The have the copyright on the blue carnation and it’s DNA. But by re-animating the carnations from cut-flowers, by bringing them back, we basically are growing them again. And of course, growth means cell division and cell division means DNA duplication. So basically, we are making illegal copies of the carnation’s DNA. The question is, whether these are copies for private use (“Privatkopie”), or whether it counts are piracy? And is it reverse bio-piracy if we “pirate” the carnations?

Shiho Fukuhara. We don’t have answers to that yet. Maybe it’s also more important to ask questions rather than answering questions at this stage.

Q. Can you talk a bit about the DIY aspect of your project. The plants in the installation look quite professional, whereas the plants in the video have a more ‘home-brew’ feeling to it…?

GT. The plants are the same. Only the containers are different. Whereas the AEC have their own BioLab where they were so kind to cultivate the flowers, we don’t really have access to a well-equipped bio lab. But that’s actually part of the project. We are deliberately using a very low-biotech approach. The purpose of this is to lower the barrier of access to the technology. And access can create understanding.

SF. I think Freeman Dyson mentioned in a quite recent essay, that Biotechnology is currently at a stage at which the Computer Industry was in the late 70ies/ early 80ies. Computer Laboratories were still quite big, only accessible to Universities and large Corporations. But a bottom-up ‘Home-brew’ Computing scene was blossoming, it seemed everybody tried to build their own “Personal Computer”. Of course then came the PC revolution and ignited a democratized access to Computer technology. I guess with biotech we are still in the late 1970ies, but it will be interesting to see where a possible Personal Biotech explosion can take us.

Q. So your artistic interest is in the biotechnology itself?

Well, our interest in biotechnology is on several level. Of course on the one hand on the practical aspects of manual laboratory work, but the conversion between bio- and info-science means, that most of biotech works is actually done in-silico, that means in a computer simulation rather than in-vivo, in the actual physical experiment. The level of code is an important bridge between the two worlds, but maybe most important from an artistic point of view are the social implications and ethical consequences that the technology evokes.
As artists, we feel we have the obligation to engage with the technology. And the best we to engage is to immerse, that why we are trying to get access to the lab work protocols and also try to communicate this bits of knowledge we hopefully gain.
It’s a bit like learning a new computer programming language. Or actually the learning of a new IDE, a new developing environment.

Q. I saw your installation at the OK Center in Linz? Is there a specific reason for the high security there? I mean, a permanent guard, several layers of bullet-proof glass, and titanium locks to secure the plant containers. Isn’t that a bit excessive?

SF. We were quite surprised too. But it seems the OK Center had to take all possible precautions to prevent the accidental spread of the flowers. We were told, that after the Ars Exhibition, they are even going to seal the room off, so if you want to get a close look at the plants, better be there soon.
Apparently the politicians of this region (Upper Austria) have adopted a highly negative view on GM plants, the goal is to make the region “free of genetic modification” (“Gentechnikfrei”). But of course, there are EU laws and legislation that clearly states, that if plants pass the test and obtain permission, then they are legal.
Of course, the so-called “fight against GMO” is mainly an emotional issue, where the facts get twisted quite a lot. One has to consider, that – for example – with canned tomato or tomato paste there is certain threshold…

GT. … I think it’s 5%.

SF. Yeah. 5 percent. So if 5% of the product is made up from genetically modified plants, it is not necessary to label is as GM.

GT. … Basically if it does not say, that no GMO are used for the product, you can be 100% sure, that GMO are used.

SF. Only if it say “No GMO used”, then there are really no GMOs inside.

Q. It sounds you have a positive attitude to GM. What exactly is your stance on Biotechnology. Are you for or against it?

SF. I don’t think it’s question of being for or against it. Biotechnology is a technology and nothing else. It is the same question, if one is for or against Computertechnology, or for or against Writing-technology. I hope this shows, that the question is absurd. It depends what the technology is used for, it depends how we deal with this emerging technology in a responsible way.

A good friend of ours – and probably the most interesting artist working with biotechnology – , Joe Davis, once said that “There are a lot of bad dreams about biotechnology, but somebody also need to have some good dreams.” We are here to dream the good dreams.

Q. I was told that your work is the only living GMO in the exhibition at the OK Center. Is that true?

GT. Yes, it seems that way. I just heart before, that the other work dealing with plants (Eduardo Kac’s Petunia) is just shown as a documentation. Apparently they could not get the legal procedures of importing the flower sorted out. I think it’s particularly funny, because Kac has a certain – shall we say – ‘history’ of presenting his artworks to the public. Especially the controversy about his Bunny project, which evolved around whether he actually made the bunny or just took ownership of it as some kind of found footage. Anyway, he did not really do enough to dispel the doubts some are having.

Watch out for Part 3 for more about hypothetical biotechnology, blue roses and the genetic modification of already genetically-modified plants.Coming soon.

Part 1: “ComFlow at Ars Electronica”

Interview conducted and provided by the Biopresence Press Office. Part 1 Part 2

Q. The Common Flowers Project is on display as part of this year’s Ars Electronica, a Media Art Festival in Linz, Austria. How do you feel being part of that festival?

Georg Tremmel: It’s great to be invited to show the Common Flowers at such a prestigious festival. We are also very happy, that the project was awarded an ‘Honorary Mention’ in Hybrid Art Category.

Q. Your Project deals with genetically-modified blue carnations. Can you tell me a bit more about them?

GT. Yeah. We think, that the blue GM carnations are very relevant and very special flowers. As far as we know, they are the very first genetically-modified product, which is neither animal feed not human food. It is purely aimed for aesthetic consumption. We believe that this represents a shift in the perception of GM plants, and that’s why we found the highly interesting in the first place.
The plants themselves are the result of decade long research by Florigene, an australian plant biotech company, which was acquired by the japanese beverage company Suntory some year back. They managed to make a couple of varieties of the blue carnation, ranging from a very light blue hue, to some quite dark blue varieties. In addition to the gene for colour, they also introduced a gene that prolongs shelf-live. The last for about 3 weeks, which is quite long for cut-flowers.

Q. But would it be easier to colour the flower with inks? Wouldn’t that be much easier, that breeding a special variety?

Shiho Fukuhara: If you would only make a couple of flowers, the ink process you mentioned would be faster, but my guess would be, that on an industrial scale it would not really make sense to use ink colouring. Too much hassle, too expensive, and probably the flowers would also not last so long.
But once you manage to create a transgene plant, which looks and behaves to your desire, it is then quite easy to duplicate and breed that plant. Really the same as growing any other non-GM plant. And don’t forget, that the cut-flower business is a huge global logistic operation, just think of the flower auctions in the Netherlands. And Suntory figured, that introducing novel varieties could be very profitable. Very profitable indeed.

Q. There are other blue flowers. Why is it not possible to conventionally breed blue carnations?

SF. As far as I know, some flowers are missing some genes and pathway, and these missing bit prevent them from making blue pedals. Obvious carnation, but also roses don’t come in blue.

Q. So they managed to make the blue carnations, but isn’t it illegal to sell genetically modified products? Especially in Europe the public seems to be very sensitive about this issue?

GT. Well, they spent a lot of time, effort and probably money to conduct trials and experiments that proved that the flowers are harmless and pose no risk to animals, humans or other plants. They were granted permission to grow, sell and distribute the flowers in their key markets, including Japan, the EU and the US.
Therefore, the plant are 100% legal, despite being genetically modified.

Q. Is it known, which genes from which plants were used to change the carnation?

GT. I believe they used a gene from Petunia to express the blue colour. No idea, what they used for the extended shelf-life, but I guess this could be easily found out. All the information regarding the genetic-manipulation of plants is freely accessible.

Q. And with your “Common Flower” project you are growing the carnation yourself?

GT. Exactly. We buy the flowers from a flower shop, cut them in small pieces, sterilize them and grow the in sterile plant containers.

SF. One could say we are bringing the flowers back to life.

GT. Yeah. Kind of. Cut flowers are basically dying a slow death from the moment they are cut. But if they are kept cool and with enough water they can survive quite a while. At least some weeks to get to the show and to the buyers house.
Carnations also come with so-called axillary buds, that are little buds that grow between each leaf and the stem. These are the most promising part for re-animation.

Q. Sounds quite complicated. Surely you must have a biotech background and a lab to your disposal…

GT. Actually no and no. We neither have a biotech background not a lab. But we have a strong interest in learning and doing basic lab work. Although our lab is the kitchen and our clean-room is an inverted plastic box.

SF. For plant containers we use baby food jars. They are ideal…

GT. … Or sake cups. The “One Cup Oseki” is particularly nice. They have nature scenes printed on the backside of the label. So when our plant are growing they can perceive images of beautiful nature.

SF. Don’t be silly.

GT. And the protocols and lists of ingredients can be downloaded from our website. It’s quite easy to get all the necessary stuff, the most difficult parts are the plastic caps for the baby food jars. They are a bit special, but they are also super cheap, and once you buy them they last forever.

SF. It’s very important for use to share and communicate this technology. We want to learn it and pass it on. Ideally everyone with interest and a bit of time should be able to grow their own blue carnations.

Q. The project title is “Common Flowers – Flower Commons”. Can you tell me a bit more about the second part, about the “Flower Commons”. What is meant by that?

GT. Common Flowers refers to the process of taking ownership of the very ‘special flowers’ that are the GM blue carnations. The goal is somewhat to take them down from their pedestal and make them ordinary. Flower Commons is the next logical step. Once we have the flowers, we can obviously not keep them in the containers forever. We realized pretty soon, that Suntory actually did do the dirty and difficult work for us. They got the permission to grow them, they obtained the proof that the plants are harmless.
Therefore we decided to set the flowers free. We want to create feral population of genetically modified blue carnation. In fact we already created some Flower Commons in Japan, Germany and also Austria. We also made a nice map of the locations, but we decided to keep it hidden for a bit longer, and see how the public reacts to the project here at the Ars Electronica.

Watch out for Part 2 for more about Bio-Sharing, Bio-Hacking, the legal challenges and the meaning of “BCL”.

… Eduardo Kac. His project ‘Natural History of the Enigma’ won the Prix Ars Electronica in the category ‘Hybrid Arts’. Fair enough, as he’s been around since some while and made some iconic works before. Now, where did I hear that again, who was trying to create plants with human DNA? Oh right, them. But of course the objectivs, motivation and technique are completely different, so congratulation Eduardo. Well done.

We are also happy to annouce, that Ars is so kind to mention us honorably, specifically for the original Common Flowers project we realised last year at the Nam June Paik Award exhibition in Cologne. Thanks to everyone involved.

Also good to see some friends doing well at this year’s Ars. In no particular order there is Yuri Suzuki’s Physical Value of Sound, doubleNegatives Architecture’s Corpora in Si(gh)te, and the [the next idea] voestalpine Art and Technology Grant
Open_Sailing_Crew’s Open Sailing Project I am particular happy for them, because they are still students at our former course at the RCA. That’s a nice way to present your final work. Well done, guys (and girls).

We are very happy to be able to participate at the fantastic exhibtion Coded Culture in Vienna. Coded Cultures is trying to cross contemporary (Media-) Art practices between Austria and Japan, (This year is the Austria-Japan Friendship year.) resulting in this exhibition in Vienna and another one in autumn in Japan.

We are showing a development of our ComFlow, a project called Common Flowers / White Out. The objective is to remove the “blue gene” of Suntory’s genetically-modified blue carnations, and try to revert them back to their original, untouched, white state.
The project is starting now, hopefully by the time Coded Cultures head to Japan we will know the results.

The opening of the exhibition is on Wednesday, 27th of May, starting at about 19h in the Museumsquartier (aka “Messepalast”). Would be great to see you there. More on the exhibtion on ORF Futurezone: Bio-hacking und Origami-Raumschiffe

ComFlow WhiteOut @ Coded Cultures / Vienna. Pre-Opening Installation Views.